12/12/1999 - INFORMAL PONDERING (CHANGE, GRIEF, AND EXPECTATIONS)

Session Start: Sun Dec 12 20:55:42 1999
*** Now talking in #SpiritualPersistence
*** Topic is ' 2,4~Informal Pondering (Change, Grief, and Expectations) 2,9Tonight 2,11at 0,129pm 2,13EST~ 0,2Hosted by Rev. Dr. Randolph Becker & Elissa Bishop Becker (and Rikkity). URL: www.spiritualpersistence.com '

TF88. . . .will E be here tonight?
RevRandy. . . .I thought so -.... I could check (O, the long walk....)
RevRandy. . . .she's not at her computer
TF88. . . .hope that didn't tire you too much randy ;)
Deb. . . .:)
RevRandy. . . .huff, huff, puff
RevRandy. . . .just let me rest for a moment
TF88. . . .lol
Deb. . . .Made me tired just watching you huff and puff like that :)
RevRandy. . . .she is down stairs, probably studying (in panic mode) for a final tomorrow on educational testing and measurement
TF88. . . .ah, a final tomorrow!
RevRandy. . . .she takes all of this very, very, very seriously
TF88. . . .not surprisingly randy
RevRandy. . . .I think it is serving a variety of roles in her life .... so I understand
RevRandy. . . .I was just not that kind of student (oh, no, fatal admission)
TF88. . . .I wasn't for many years...then boom, got super serious about studying
TF88. . . .but I used to be so afraid of learning, didn't think I could do anything but play the piano :)
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RevRandy. . . .hello journey
Deb. . . .Hi Journey
TF88. . . .hi journey
journey. . . .hi Rev, hi Tf and Deb
Deb. . . .Thats ok I understand..all I wanted was to be a mama, and wife...worked out fine while I was younger :)
RevRandy. . . .I think we were all duped in a way - that we would have a single path of life - a "career" and then we discovered that life is multi-pathed
RevRandy. . . .(ah,,,,, I just heard a distant door open and close ... maybe the divine Ms. E is on her way here)
journey. . . .lol
RevRandy. . . .But I do think that many of us, when life presented change points, didn't know what to do
Deb. . . .Yes I think that is true Rev..or afraid to try something new.
TF88. . . .when I was at Oberlin College, my mother was furious because I signed up for a course outside of the conservatory
TF88. . . .but it turned out to be one of the most fascinating classes I ever took... such a great experience
TF88. . . .an anthropology course..absolutely super
TF88. . . .but I had to completely defy my mom's wishes to take it
RevRandy. . . .I had a similar experience with a sociology course that opened me up from physics
journey. . . .TF it sounds as tho it was a huge independent step for you
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RevRandy. . . .hi DJ
DJ. . . .Hi Rev
TF88. . . .oh, that huge independent step took many many years!
RevRandy. . . .but then you became yourself more
TF88. . . .yes, absolutely
Deb. . . .But you did it TF
journey. . . .Well, Hats off to you! Good for you!
TF88. . . .thanks!
RevRandy. . . .as Rikkity would remind us, it is not a matter of time, but of substance and meaning
RevRandy. . . .so you are moving to where you know you need to go ... when, and how long it (took) or takes is less important
TF88. . . .yes randy, that is very true indeed
RevRandy. . . .I find that thought very freeing - that I need not be bound by time expectations
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Elissa. . . .hi everyone!!!
TF88. . . .There she is!!!
Deb. . . .HI Elissa
RevRandy. . . .And here she is
journey. . . .Hello Elissa
Elissa. . . .ta-da!
Elissa. . . .what are we talking about?
Elissa. . . .besides me lol
RevRandy. . . .we are talking about you
RevRandy. . . .lol
TF88. . . .elissa, your favorite topic... that we have forever to get something learned :)
Deb. . . .:)
Elissa. . . .i wish i had forever to learn the stuff i need to know for my final tomorrow!!!
RevRandy. . . .you will have all the time you need
journey. . . .think positive Elissa :)
Elissa. . . .ok journey...i'm positive i won't know it all by tomorrow lol
journey. . . .hahaha, sure you will
Deb. . . .You'll do just fine Elissa
Elissa. . . .thanks deb
TF88. . . .everything is practice anyway, even if they label it a test
Elissa. . . .very true tf
Elissa. . . .whatever i do, i'll do
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RevRandy. . . .hello Tayler
journey. . . .hi tayler
Elissa. . . .hi tayler
Tayler. . . .Hello and peace all.
Elissa. . . .o well, enough about me
RevRandy. . . .we had gotten onto a topic of how we make choices to move from familiar patterns and expectations into new things
journey. . . .scary stuff
Tayler. . . .O.K.
Elissa. . . .yes it is scary stuff
RevRandy. . . .but we can also choose to move from that familiar and expected topic into new ones
Tayler. . . .Change can be scary and exciting too.
RevRandy. . . .I used to think there was a qualitative difference between change I initiated and change that happen to me
TF88. . . .I really think it's a matter of whether or not we trust ourselves to adapt... and to allow ourselves the right to change our minds at any moment
Elissa. . . .good point tf
Elissa. . . .one thing i tell my grief counseling clients is that you can make change less scary by changing something deliberately, with control
Elissa. . . .and it can be a very small thing
RevRandy. . . .but I think I agree with TF - and about it being more a question of trusting ourselves in a change situation
Tayler. . . .Yes..I agree that change effects us differently if we initiate it.
Elissa. . . .yes, and when we feel overwhelmed and out of control it can help us trust the process when we realize we still do have some choices
RevRandy. . . .co-creators, not just victims
Elissa. . . .right
journey. . . .yes, i agree
Tayler. . . .Sometimes I feel its more positive if we control it rather than have it thrust upon us...what about you?
Elissa. . . .it certainly feels that way tayler
TF88. . . .well, tayler, we cannot control many events, but we can control our own reaction to those events
RevRandy. . . .We cannot choose all the changes we will experience, but we can choose how we will react to them
Tayler. . . .Yes that's true RevR anf TF
journey. . . .i tend to go with the flow
journey. . . .once heard lovely bit of wisdom, if you cant fight and cant flee, then go with the flow
RevRandy. . . .But, here's a wrinkle - when we pretend we have some control when we really do not - so change comes as a double whammy
Elissa. . . .o that's a biggie!
Tayler. . . .For sure!!
RevRandy. . . .I know - been there, done that
RevRandy. . . .and I find, for myself, that going with the flow in such times, makes it bearable if not desirable
Elissa. . . .i wonder whether we tend to confuse control and change with the opportunities the universe provides for us... we tend to see change as negative because we think so linearly
Elissa. . . .does that make any sense at all????
Elissa. . . .lol
Tayler. . . .I was there when my mom passed over...out of control...pretending to be in control. Big mistake!
RevRandy. . . .good example Tayler .... say some more
Tayler. . . .I felt like I was the one dying...
Tayler. . . .but i hid it to be strong for my family.
Tayler. . . .All came crashing down after about a year!!
Tayler. . . .I had to let go of the control in order to regain it.
RevRandy. . . .YES
Elissa. . . .o ((((((tayler)))))) that's such a normal experience! i hear it all the time...you need to focus on caring for your loved one so you don't deal with your own feelings...of course!
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RevRandy. . . .hi suwan
Elissa. . . .hey suwan!
Deb. . . .Hi suwan
TF88. . . .hi suwan!
suwan. . . .Hi Rev, Elissa, Everyone
journey. . . .Hi Suwan
Tayler. . . .Hi suwan.
suwan. . . .:))))
Tayler. . . .NOW i realize this is a normal process...but at the time!
RevRandy. . . .And could you, or I, or any of us, done much different at the time .... in the midst of the loss, the big change
Elissa. . . .yes i know...and it does complicate the process sometimes because you think you haven't felt what you were "supposed" to
Tayler. . . .yes :o)
Elissa. . . .one of the hardest lessons we need to learn, it seems, is just self- acceptance...so few people really think they're ok
RevRandy. . . .in fact, in the midst of what we are experiencing, we probably do not feel OK
Tayler. . . .I think this is an excellent forum...death...and after-death should be talked about and discussed...not hidden.
RevRandy. . . .o yes - but people are fearful of death, and more so of after- death
suwan. . . .and more so of the bereaved!
Elissa. . . .yes suwan, definitely
Elissa. . . .yes tayler, there are so many misconceptions about it because people don't talk about it... we all want to pretend that death is optional...until it touches our lives
Tayler. . . .true
Elissa. . . .(or more likely hits us over the head like a brick lol)
Elissa. . . .one the most important things i do as a grief counselor is just reassure people that they're normal!!! can you imagine???
Elissa. . . .people think they're going crazy and our culture wants to give them a pill or tell them to get on with their lives...sheeeesh
RevRandy. . . .but our perception is that death is not normal
RevRandy. . . .a perception given by culture (society, religion, etc)
Tayler. . . .Now that i know life goes on in a positive way...I don't grieve nearly as much. Just in self pity occasionally.
Elissa. . . .yes tayler, it's that balance we always talk about here
TF88. . . .ack, it's the pills that drive me crazy! too much masking of symptoms instead of looking at the cause
RevRandy. . . .now you've hit on one of Elissa topics
Elissa. . . .yes, tf, it's that good ol' medical model we love so much...dr. welby and company
Elissa. . . .i just did a research paper on medicating grief
Tayler. . . .yes TF that often happens...doctors don't allow you to feel...and get on with it!
RevRandy. . . .(I would add that it was an excellent paper)
Elissa. . . .ty, randy
Elissa. . . .sometimes it seems like the world is on prozac lol
TF88. . . .well, part of it is when we ask others to take over the "fixing" of us, instead of being involved in the process
Elissa. . . .yep, another way we give our power away Tayler. . . .4 sure TF.
Elissa. . . .but it's also because it's socially desirable to be perceived as doing "well" and the medication can do that, so you get positive feedback
RevRandy. . . .it seems to me that what is often being medicated is the physicians pain at dealing with the patients intense grief
Deb. . . .True Rev
Elissa. . . .that happens a lot, too, randy (as you know from my paper)
RevRandy. . . .in a culture that asks us to stop being publicly sad after a week, what can you expect
Tayler. . . .But I'm sure you all agree that all this understanding and acceptance takes time...doesn't happen over night.
Elissa. . . .o tayler, it can take a lifetime...or more likely many lifetimes
RevRandy. . . .Tayler, I have found that as time passes I learn more and more, and I know now that it will, as Elissa just wrote, be a part of my life(lives) ahead
Tayler. . . .yes.
RevRandy. . . .to have loved enough to feel such a loss means that such love (and therefore loss) cannot be dissolved away, only understood and valued
Elissa. . . .we would never want to lose the relationship...so much of what i do is also showing people how that relationship exists within them always...it doesn't require the physical presence of their loved one
Tayler. . . .Death ends a life...not a relationship.
RevRandy. . . .yes!
Tayler. . . .Not my quote by the way.
Elissa. . . .exactly...a physical life
journey. . . .we grasp at the physical aspects tho, and pity ourselves a lot i think
journey. . . .sorry i stuttered
Elissa. . . .journey, the pain is real and i'm not comfortable with calling it self-pity, but it can be a part of the experience without being the whole experience
Elissa. . . .we still miss them
Tayler. . . .thats it Elissa.
Elissa. . . .it's nothing to be ashamed of and it doesn't make us weak
RevRandy. . . .and we will always miss the physical part of them, even as we continue to connect to the spiritual part
journey. . . .elissa it helped a lot during thanksgiving to be in the reality of it..miss them and pity ourselves
Elissa. . . .((((((journey)))))) i'm glad you allowed yourself to do that
journey. . . .i gained a deeper understanding
journey. . . .ty and rev
Tayler. . . .It's a journey...Journey
journey. . . .lol :) sure is
RevRandy. . . .and I think, going back a ways in this discussion, we need to be able to be open to our feelings of sadness (pity) for ourselves rather than hide it away like a bad feeling
journey. . . .yes, when you are the one that holds the others up there comes a time when you pity yourself, that is what i felt
RevRandy. . . .if we are feeling it, it is part of us, and since we are inherently good, so it must have some meaning within that pattern of goodness .... now our task is to discover what
Elissa. . . .journey it sounds like you let go and just felt what you were feeling
Tayler. . . .Maybe you'll have to let the others stand on their own journey?
Tayler. . . .On holidays...I find, we think of our loved ones more, and times past...therefore we hurt a bit more at those times.
TF88. . . .so what can you do after holding others up for so long, and then when YOU need some holding up...no one is available?
TF88. . . .this is something that's been troubling me
journey. . . .you can relate what you experienced and be supportive
journey. . . .and know you are at last human
Tayler. . . .Maybe the others will take THEIR turn now.
journey. . . .they do take their turn
journey. . . .they wait i think because they think you dont want or need it
Tayler. . . .good to hear.
Elissa. . . .you can say clearly what it is you need and then find out who is really there for you...or you can find a way to fill that need by creating your own energy and not letting so much of your own be "diverted" for others' use
Tayler. . . .you have to let them know how you feel...where it still hurts.
TF88. . . .thank you elissa...I have found I mostly needed to do the latter of the two. I admit, i have felt disappointed and guilty because I feel disappointed
RevRandy. . . .TF - maybe you can't expect the ones whom you have held up to be there for you .... but you can find others who can be
Tayler. . . .true Rev
journey. . . .elissa, one of the most empowering things for me was putting that "picture" on the table
Elissa. . . .it's great to hear that you did that, journey...i know it's something that has helped a lot of people
RevRandy. . . .If we look only to a limited field of relationship, then we may not find a reciprocity of support -- but if we look to our wider web of interdependence that support should be there
Elissa. . . .i know, tf, i've felt that too...it's very hard to come to terms with the reality that others cannot fill our needs...so often we think that's what love is about
journey. . . .TF, when you are strong person they look to you for guidance and when you hurt..in ways it is more hurtful, but more cleansing for them i have discovered
journey. . . .it's strange as tho by seeing your pain they heal and find a part of themselves, so do share your feelings
Elissa. . . .that can happen, too
journey. . . .and of course we have these wonderful rooms to share
Tayler. . . .Kind of brings us back to the letting go of control/change thing.
RevRandy. . . .it does ...
TF88. . . .well, i have learned to not expect emotional support from several who I thought would be there. but, at the present time, I guess they are not capable of it
Tayler. . . .This may change also TF.
TF88. . . .yes, that's true tayler
journey. . . .Tf, sometimes it changes
Elissa. . . .yes and it isn't because they don't love you or don't want to be there...one thing i've found helpful to remember is that most people don't do things for negative reasons
Tayler. . . .I felt that my father would never be capable of talking about my mom...after her death. But that changed eventually...and we do.
Elissa. . . .that's wonderful tayler
Tayler. . . .But there were a lot of changes during that time in our relating to one another.
journey. . . .Tf, also if others feel that you are advanced spiritually, they think you dont feel the pain of grief
Elissa. . . .ooooooo don't get me started on that one!!! grrrrrr lol
TF88. . . .I don't really know what to make of it journey
journey. . . .:), they throw it in your face
RevRandy. . . .one basic thing in all of this .... we do not (and should not feel we) have to go through this all alone
suwan. . . .well Rev other than people here on line there aren't too many people who want to go through it with you!
RevRandy. . . .no, suwan, but we got us ... don't we
Elissa. . . .that's true suwan
journey. . . .true suwan
suwan. . . .just us, i find that real world people don't want to hear about it
TF88. . . .yes, very true
RevRandy. . . .but I find when I speak about this place and these people, others out there are open to it .... without knowing how
journey. . . .rev, but do they come?
RevRandy. . . .some do, and other just want to have whispered (for now) conversations with me
journey. . . .i find some do and others..are thinking i am just a little bit out there
journey. . . .but they call me when stuff happens
suwan. . . .lol well journey, .....
Tayler. . . .lol know what you mean journey.
RevRandy. . . .some of my colleagues will not say much about what we are doing publicly, but then refer parishioners to us and to here
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journey. . . .hi kybear
journey. . . .welcome
RevRandy. . . .hey ky
TF88. . . .{{Ky}}
kybear. . . .thank you hello all..:)
Elissa. . . .suwan all you can do is keep the door open...eventually we all experience grief and then they'll know who to come to
Elissa. . . .hey ky!
kybear. . . .((((hugs)))
kybear. . . .hi sweetie lissa :)
Elissa. . . .:)
journey. . . .Tf, I feel for you, know that my thoughts are with you
TF88. . . .thank you journey :)
Tayler. . . .well all...must go...thank you for your wisdom and understanding. Will return again...
journey. . . .nite tayler
RevRandy. . . .be well, Tayler,
TF88. . . .light and love Tayler
Elissa. . . .nite tayler...it was good chatting with you
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RevRandy. . . .I want to pose a query - about the difference between expectation and openness
RevRandy. . . .as it applies to support for us in our grieving process
Elissa. . . .it's time for me to get back to the books...before the query :)
RevRandy. . . .no, no books
RevRandy. . . .stay
Elissa. . . .hahahaha
Elissa. . . .ok 5 more minutes
journey. . . .hmmm, your man has spoken :)
journey. . . .you guys are cute couple
RevRandy. . . . RevRandy slowly creeps out and locks Elissa at the computer
Elissa. . . .and i obey as always :)
journey. . . .hahaha yeah right....we all do :)
RevRandy. . . .sure
RevRandy. . . .yeh
Elissa. . . .of course...sure...that's the ticket
RevRandy. . . .that's the ticket
Elissa. . . .lol
RevRandy. . . .LOL
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Elissa. . . .hey boobie!
RevRandy. . . .hi Bobbie
Bobbie. . . .hi everyone!
TF88. . . .hi bobbie
Bobbie. . . .hi TF
Elissa. . . .so what's the query already???
RevRandy. . . .do we get openness and expectation confused, when in fact expectation is the opposite of openness, for we have closed off many avenues
RevRandy. . . .we expect people to be there, but in fact we are in that very act closing off other possibilities
journey. . . .i think it is very good question
Elissa. . . .that's certainly true, if i understand you
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RevRandy. . . .ah, serenity, just when I need it
journey. . . .hi serenity
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TF88. . . .hi serenity, hanna
Bobbie. . . .hiya hanna!
Elissa. . . .hi serenity. nice name
serenity. . . .ty elissa
RevRandy. . . .Hey Hanna
journey. . . .hi hanna!
Elissa. . . .((((((hanna))))))
kybear. . . .hello hanna dear :) ((((((((((hugs)))))))))
Hanna. . . .hey guys! :)
Hanna. . . .Hope I'm not interrupting anything :(
RevRandy. . . .Hanna - you look more mature, wiser, more insightful (older even......)
journey. . . .right on time hanna
Bobbie. . . .yup, right on time Hanna
TF88. . . .LOL randy
Hanna. . . .lol
Hanna. . . .Thanks Rev :P
Elissa. . . .actually hanna you missed all the best parts
journey. . . .good discussion beginning
RevRandy. . . .so, another digit gone by, Hanna
Elissa. . . .happy birthday, ms. h!!!
Hanna. . . .And so to you too Rev! hehehe
RevRandy. . . .ty - we Sag's have to hang together
RevRandy. . . .did you party?
Hanna. . . .I'm too old for that now.. lol
Deb. . . .:)
Hanna. . . .But the bottle of vino was pretty dang good :)
RevRandy. . . .after doing it last night, I feel too old for it tonight!
Elissa. . . .party? she didn't even pick up my card...must be getting really feeble lol
Hanna. . . .lol
RevRandy. . . .wine or card, wine or card, such a choice
journey. . . .journey like wine of course
Elissa. . . .you guys are ancient!
Bobbie. . . .not me! I'm just somewhere between God and dirt.....LOL
Hanna. . . .hahahaha
Deb. . . .cute :)
journey. . . .rev, i think openness and expectation are not really that confusable
Elissa. . . .back to the query
RevRandy. . . .ok - back to serious
Elissa. . . .randy i think you'd better state it again
RevRandy. . . .state it again .... my aged mind reels at the thought
journey. . . .openness to me is being available to anything and expectation is waiting for something you have in mind of how it should be
Elissa. . . .yes journey, that's a good definition
TF88. . . .excellent journey
journey. . . .ty
Bobbie. . . .openness to me is the belief in what is to come, and expectation is the anticipation of the same thing
RevRandy. . . .but I was thinking that in the midst of loss (grief) our energy to differentiate becomes lower
journey. . . .true
Elissa. . . .can you give an example, randy?
RevRandy. . . .I was thinking of what we were speaking about before .....
RevRandy. . . .and how when Ericka died there were some I thought I would hear from, some I expected to hear from, and therefore some I needed to hear from
RevRandy. . . .who did not make contact .... and I found myself trying to deal with the pain that such thwarted expectation meant for me at that time
RevRandy. . . .and later I realized that others were reaching out, others I did not expect, in ways that could have been more healing
Elissa. . . .that's quite a learning
journey. . . .can you tell us what you felt when your expectations were not met
RevRandy. . . .I felt angry, I felt belittled, I felt betrayed, I felt very alone,
RevRandy. . . .I felt like I was invisible, that my pain was invisible
RevRandy. . . .like I did not exist in some way
Elissa. . . .((((((randy))))))
journey. . . .in the moment were you able to see the fear in others?, i felt it took time
RevRandy. . . .no, I could not see anything in them - I was too wrapped up in my own grieving
RevRandy. . . .later I found some very unexpected sources of support reaching out
Elissa. . . .so our expectations close us off to possibilities
RevRandy. . . .that's what I found .... or our dealing with the failure of expectations uses our energy that could have opened us
Elissa. . . .even to other ways... those same people we feel are not there for us may be there for us in ways we don't expect and so don't allow
journey. . . .i think being open is very difficult at times
journey. . . .it's like a leap of faith
Bobbie. . . .especially when you're hurting....
Elissa. . . .especially when we think we know what we need...yes
TF88. . . .a leap of faith in oneself
journey. . . .we are often like the frog with the broken leg, a half hop and a prayer :)
Elissa. . . .haven't heard that one journey
journey. . . .it's an original. hehe :)
Elissa. . . .ah that's why lol...i like it
Elissa. . . .i think we often underestimate how strong we are and overestimate how much we need from others
RevRandy. . . .but sometimes we only need the cheers from them, not the actual support, to know we are not in an empty arena of pain
Elissa. . . .and now i really do need to get back to studying... carry on you wonderful guys!
RevRandy. . . .so, everyone - what shall we discuss now.....
RevRandy. . . .o, she is going ....
RevRandy. . . .maybe it is time for all of us to also call it a night
RevRandy. . . .(or you can stay here chatting away)
Elissa. . . .no randy. you stay :)
Bobbie. . . .what're you studying E?
journey. . . .no holding her now, go elissa go! get that A
RevRandy. . . .but I am beat ..... all that wine you plied me with last night
Elissa. . . .i have a final tomorrow on psychological testing...ugh
Bobbie. . . .ahhh, good luck! and great blessings!
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Bobbie. . . .hi DL
DancingLeaves. . . .hi bobbie
journey. . . .Hi dl
DancingLeaves. . . .hi journey
TF88. . . .hi DL
DancingLeaves. . . .hi tf
Elissa. . . .thanks. nite all...love you!
TF88. . . .light and love Elissa
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RevRandy. . . .well, she is gone ..... back to her studying
TF88. . . .I'm going to head out too...night everyone
RevRandy. . . .TF - be well -
kybear. . . .night tf dear
serenity. . . .nite tf
journey. . . .TF, I'll say prayers for you
Bobbie. . . .night TF
TF88. . . .thank you journey :)
suwan. . . .night tickle!
TF88. . . .light and love all
journey. . . .take care hon
suwan. . . .so, has anyone seen The Green Mile?
Bobbie. . . .the what suwan?
serenity. . . .read it suwan
Hanna. . . .night tF!
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suwan. . . .new movie
suwan. . . .it is the coolest!
serenity. . . .the book was great
suwan. . . .it stars Tom Hanks
suwan. . . .it is awesome
serenity. . . .stephen king wrote the book
suwan. . . .all of you run out and see it tomorrow!
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suwan. . . .not a movie for young ones!
RevRandy. . . .hello dafny
dafny. . . .hello rev
journey. . . .do you think this movie is part of what i call the movement toward spirituality?
journey. . . .the questioning of things outside any specific religion?
suwan. . . .i would say so journey
Hanna. . . .I think so journey
Bobbie. . . .great journey...I can't stand "organized religions"....blah!
journey. . . .i just believe we all have the right to believe, they all serve a purpose one way or another
dafny. . . .what movie are you talking about?
kybear. . . .the green mile dear
dafny. . . .The Green Mile, haven't heard of it :-)
RevRandy. . . .I am intrigued that some of the more fundamentalist sects want to make more movies of their own because they are worried about the current crop of spiritual movies that aren't specifically religious
RevRandy. . . .while I am enjoying the flower of spirituality beyond the confines of specific religions
Bobbie. . . .I agree with both, but take offense when they come to my door and try and force it on me.....
serenity. . . .agreed bobbie
RevRandy. . . .I always offer a trade, I will take theirs if they will take mine -- had no takers yet with such a deal
Bobbie. . . .LOL great idea Rev!!!!!
journey. . . .Rev, i bet you deal with a lot of questions.. but are a patient individual
RevRandy. . . .o yes .... but if you open yourself to them with love, patience is easy
RevRandy. . . .I see them as people, not as doctrine or dogma .... just another soul trying to make it through life with meaning
journey. . . .yes, exactly
journey. . . .you know what, i have really nice jehovah people that come to my door and they never know what to make of me
Hanna. . . .lol journey
journey. . . .i just say i appreciate your desire to help others regardless of beliefs, have a nice day :)
Bobbie. . . .I....*ahem*....*blush*....painted one once......caught me in a bad mood while painting my bathroom.....
RevRandy. . . .what color
Hanna. . . .Bobbie! You didn't! lol
Bobbie. . . .yup...I did....dayglow yellow!
serenity. . . .bet they never came back bobbie.......lol
Bobbie. . . .nope! LOL
RevRandy. . . .could see them coming for months
Bobbie. . . .yup! hehe
RevRandy. . . .so if any of you have anyone come to your door with a yellow stripe, you know where they came from
journey. . . .hahha
Bobbie. . . .true...but only in CA, we're in IN now....LOL
Hanna. . . .lol
Bobbie. . . .haven't painted any here....
Bobbie. . . .course haven't painted any bathrooms either.....*grin*
RevRandy. . . .good Bobbie, good Bobbie, now put down the brush (and the Chalupa)
serenity. . . .is that why you moved bobbie?
Bobbie. . . .ROFLMAO!!!
Bobbie. . . .no, it was to get a change of scenery...sort of
Bobbie. . . .but I LIKE chalupas Rev!
RevRandy. . . .So, we reach toward the end, and we degenerate rather completely - I like it
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Bobbie. . . .hehe
RevRandy. . . .hey Sharon
Bobbie. . . .hi Sharon
Sharon. . . .hi revrandy
Hanna. . . .Hi sharon
serenity. . . .hi sharon
Sharon. . . .hi bobbie, hanna, serenity
Sharon. . . .and anyone I missed
RevRandy. . . .you caught us just as we were discussing Bobbie's participation in the witness relocation program because of unspeakable crimes in California
Sharon. . . .k
Bobbie. . . .yup....I'm deadly with a paint brush!
Bobbie. . . .a dingdong painting! ROFL
Sharon. . . .isn't it dangerous to be discussing it?
Bobbie. . . .naw......they'll never find me....
Sharon. . . .k then bobbi
RevRandy. . . .well, folks of the fifth dimension .... it is about time to call it a night
RevRandy. . . .I don't have Elissa's gift of giving you music
RevRandy. . . .so
RevRandy. . . ."Some where over the rainbow
RevRandy. . . .......
RevRandy. . . .etc.
Bobbie. . . .wait
RevRandy. . . .wait?
RevRandy. . . .WAIT?
RevRandy. . . . 4 WHAT?
Bobbie. . . .nuts...can't find it!
kybear. . . .night all sweet dreams
Sharon. . . .nite kybear
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Sharon. . . .she has her own music??
RevRandy. . . .she has the text generator to send it out over these chat lines
Bobbie. . . .night gang! I'm off too! snnnnzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Sharon. . . .nite bobbie
RevRandy. . . .nite to all - good getting together - sunny solstice to all
journey. . . .nite, me too, going to surf, stay well and stand in the light! [Bobbie SOUND]
Bobbie. . . .there it is!
Bobbie. . . .my favorite...rainbow connection by Kermit the Frog
RevRandy. . . .so, to all a good week - and meaningful time
suwan. . . .night rev, see that movie and have a good week!
RevRandy. . . .I will got to see it
Bobbie. . . .me three! night all! sleep well and God Bless!
RevRandy. . . .blessings
Sharon. . . .nite randy
serenity. . . .is anyone staying?
RevRandy. . . .nite Sharon - dream well -
Sharon. . . .thanx randy
RevRandy. . . .I think we are all packing it in. except for @}i{ our trained guard bot
serenity. . . .well goodnight...........peace, love joy and serenity
RevRandy. . . .night - all good things to you
serenity. . . .as to you rev
Session Close: Sun Dec 12 23:05:20 1999

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the Rev Dr Randolph and Elissa Bishop Becker, M.Ed., LPC, NCC
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